Fur color

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum. I frequent glider gossip and in need of some help. We have two male, neutered gliders. Omi and Kai. They are about two years old each. When we got them they were beautiful and grey. They were also on pellets. No I know pellets are not a good diet so I've heard. Once we changed them to BML,they started changing to a kind of brownish color. I changed to HPW because I was afraid BML may be causing some problem. Then there was Candy's' blended diet and LGRS for two months Oct-Dec 2011. I put them back on HPW original this January and have noticed a really grey area coming up on Omis' hindquarter. I posted pictures on Glider gossip but haven't quite figured out how to do it here yet. They both eat pretty good. Heres another problem, Omi is 138g and Kai is 88g. Is this normal weights for adults? Omi is very squishy. I took him to the vet yesterday and she said he looked really healthy and he has no scaling of the skin or parasites where the grey is. I am so confused as to what it could possibly be. I looked at pictures of other gliders and they look a lot like butter cream gliders. But them there is that spot and a few other grey spots coming up on his shoulder. Is an off-colored coat always indicative of a bad diet? Is it possible we've had butter creams all along and they get grey on a bad diet?

It would help a lot if we could see photos of them. You could use photobucket.com and then paste the image code here.
Did the vet do fecals on them when you were there or just check their skin?

You need to stick with one diet for about 6 months before you will get an idea of their true coloring. Just switching to a "good" diet and then switching those around will not clear diet related staining. They need consistency for their system to settle enough to begin clearing fur staining. Give this diet a try for several more months and then let us know how they look.

And, yes, we would love photos. Photos are often the best teaching tool we have.

Also, if you can please put your other screen name in your signature, it would help people know who you are.

This is Omis hindquarter. I have been in contact with Viciousencounters and she's helping me on trying to figure a good fruit and veggie mix for them. I told her what we feed them and apparently, everything is high in phosphorous and or oxalates. She didn't do fecal tests. She wants to do a blood panel to check his calcium phosphorous and liver/kidney function. Their urine does smell kind of bad. Just like they don't drink enough water.

Just as a precaution, they need to have fecals done to rule out parasites. That is a very important thing to do if they haven't had it yet. I'm no diet expert so I'll excuse myself out of that one. lol I leave diet to the glider owners that are more well-versed in that category. (They do look stained though)
Try to get fecals. It's important.

A parasite can discolor fur? Wow.

Any health issue can discolor fur.

my sweet boys

Now I'm really worried.

I wouldn't worry yourself sick, you just want to rule out things like parasites since they can be so prevelant in gliders. I only have 4 gliders and 2 of them had two different kinds of parasites when they first came into my home. That's why you want to have the vet do fecals. If he/she is knowledgable in gliders, they should have done a fecal float/smear as their standard on a glider checkup. You may want to find a new vet if he/she didn't even consider doing a fecal at all. (There is a list of vets per state, here on this site) Once you know they are ok in this dept, you have one big worry off of the plate and you can start enjoying your gliders and monitoring their fur/diet.

On the hindquarters, in the picture, it doesn't look like grey spots, but thinning fur. Maybe it's just the picture, but if that is the case there is a problem you haven't found yet.

No, the fur is consistent in texture and fullness throughout his body. He does have a few spots where grey seems to be coming back. We were told by the breeder to always add calcium to their diet. Albeit she wanted us to feed pellets. She said always give them calcium and Bugs n berries. As more questions come up, I'm getting more worried. He acts just fine and his energy level is okay for a chubby glider. I know the members on GG said his weight was fine but I think for his stature or frame, he is chunky. Neither one is yellow on the belly. They both look pretty light and soft. I'm just not understanding Thus being why I am here and on GG frantically looking for help. I took a look at the critter love table food items and am still confused even though it is apparently specific. I want to go with Table 1: food with ideal ca: P ratios. It reads
FOOD
by the cup I'm assuming mustard greens 104 mg calcium 58 mg phosphorous 1.8:1 ca :P ratio. Does that mean I have to feed them a cup? Or do I mix all the ingredients i.e. mustard greens, leeks,watercress, chard, endime, green leaf lettuce, blackberries and raspberries a cup of each, blend and serve a tbsp? There are no instructions. As I've said, I am mathematically challenged and don't understand so I guess I need someone to basically dumb it down for me.

Meals should never be about math. If you are worried about calculations and such, then it is time to focus on what is REALLY important with the diets you feed. Diets should be about feeding NUTRITIOUS meals that provide all of the vitamins and minerals and nutrients necessary to maintain healthy tissues and organs. I don't know how/why we got to this point in the community where we encourage people to worry so much about ratios and numbers. It is not necessary.

If you have questions about the diet suggestions listed on Critter love, you need to address them with Peggy.

If you are feeding the original HPW, you do NOT need to add more calcium. Follow the diet plan as written.

Your little one is a fine weight.

Val what am I supposed to feed with the HPW?

Mysweetboys,

I recommend you contacting Peggy directly. She is always happy to help you with one of her diets. Critterlove@critterlove.com.

Thanks you guys. Lisa contacted me and I have responded.

Lisa, I totally agree. Like I stated in the email, variety and moderation is the key. You have your gliders to bring you joy and contentment not stress so dont stress so much over the diet.

No need to add supplements. Feed the HPW a variety of vegetables and fruit (or go by one of the mixtures if you think it will help you) and just relax. Enjoy your babies.

Quote :

I don't know how/why we got to this point in the community where we encourage people to worry so much about ratios and numbers. It is not necessary.

Val, I couldnt agree with this more.

The patches of grey fur look to be new growth of fur that hasn't been stained yet. They may be losing fur or their fur is thinning but not so much that the amount is noticeable. Rule out a parasite issue and it's probably just due to the frequent changes in their diet. It's so hard to say what started the issues since you've been changing their diet frequently.

I have to agree..... definately get a fecal done on them

I know. I am not changing the diet anymore. A while back, Omi wasn't grooming that area very well and his brother was well, lets just says, no helper there . We actually got that area wet and combed the food/junk out and this is what was under it. I do believe we are on the right track now but will inquire about a fecal.

just wondering how your babies are doing?

They are doing just fine now. They seem to have more energy and their urine does not smell as bad. The urine tends to smell bad if they are fed peas. Too much phosphorous? Anyhoo, they ate their greens the second and third night but last night it was like they were saying they don't want them. Guess I need to offer a different veggie or two tonight.

I mix up the veggies they get, so that they don't have the same ones each night. Same thing with the fruit.

Hey guys... quick update, the boys are doing awesome with their new f/v menu. Their urine no longer smells strong and because they've been on HPW original for 3 months now, their fur is starting to get grey at the roots. They are changing back into gliders! Woot

I tookKai for a fecal today because he felt as if he'd lost some weight. It was negative but he's lost 7 grams in a month. He refuses to eat HPW. I know I said I wouldn't switch him again but have to. I had a few cubes of LGRS left in the freezer and fed that to him the other morning and he attacked it like he'd never eaten before. They are doing fine on their f/v though.Unfortunately, gliders cannot be vegetarians. Been loading him up with mealies too. Offering him pretty much anything we can think of. One good thing though, they both look real good now. Like I told another member, I can sacrifice Kais grey coat to stained. I'd rather him be a little stained and healthy than grey and starved to death.

Watch the mealies, they are high in fat, and not much else. I don't know how many you are offering but 3 or 4 should be it.
What is Kai's weight? I know you said he lost 7 grams, so am wondering where he is. What else did the vet say, did it seem as if he's ill?

Want to share a couple of pictures of Omis' small grey spot. That one was 1/22/12

This one is today. Am I seeing things or is the grey spreading? I'm assuming this is good?