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Goldwinger

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PostSubject: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 12:54 am

I saw this post on GG and referred them to call Val. Any advice or ideas on what this could be. It was nothing I'd ever read or heard of before.

http://www.sugarglider.com/glidergossip/topic.asp?whichpage=1&TOPIC_ID=25744&#203327

I posted it here since this is a medical forum and for future reference just in case it ever comes up again in the future with another glider owner. I hope it is okay that I put the link here. If it should be somewhere else on this forum PLEASE move it for me as I wasn't sure where to post it. I know this glider has NOT seen a Vet yet.

Thank you.


Last edited by Goldwinger on Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:10 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added)
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:04 am

Anita
I have moved this thread for this reason, posted in the mysteries forum:

Quote :
This particular forum is not to be used for discussing cases in which the glider's have not been to the vet or have seen a vet, but had no tests run. In those cases, I advise that you have more tests run.

This glider has not seen a vet. Therefore, the only mystery is why in the heck anyone would let a glider suffer like that.?.

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Goldwinger

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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:38 pm

Thank you Val for answering her on GG and for moving the post. In the future I will post thread's like this here. I think it's a great idea to have these especially if they finally get the glider to the Vet and we get a comfirmed diagnisis it helps. I see she finally got this glider to the Vet and now knows what it is. Thank you again.
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 4:21 pm

I can't imagine that the poor baby isn't in pain. :(
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 4:26 pm

I'm sorry, but I'm going to call BS on this one.

This girl is lying and I hate that no one picks up on it.

She posted at 10:00 ish that she found a vet 2 hours away from her and that the vet would see her this afternoon.

She then posted at 11:27 that she has seen the vet and the vet's diagnosis is "busted a traqueal tube" and that the glider is not in any pain.

Now, what vet did she see? According to her earlier posts, there are NO vets. There is no way that she drove 2 hours to the vet, 2 hours home AND had a vet appointment. No way.

BUT, if I give her the benefit of the doubt and say that she was posting from her phone or something, there are still a LOT of problems with her posts:

1) She says
Quote :
"I have located a vet about 2 hours away and they will see her this afternoon"
So, even if she was posting from her phone, she did not have time to get to the vet and get an exam for a situation such as this, consult with the vet, AND be posting an hour and a half later. Not to mention, no one says "this afternoon" at 10:00 when they mean 11:30.

2) She says that the glider "busted a traqueal tube."
There is no such thing as a TRAQUEAL tube. So, I'm going to assume she misspelled "tracheal." If that is the case, then "busting" it would be life threatening. PERIOD. If you cut YOUR trachea, the only way to save your life would be surgery to correct it and possibly a temporary tracheostomy. The trachea is a very vital structure in the body, and any injury to it is treated as life threatening. TRUST ME people, this is my daily job - the process of respiration is ESSENTIAL to speaking, so all speech-language pathologists are required to study and understand all of the structures, organs and processes required for breathing. When one has a laceration to the trachea, the body does not fill with air. This is not how the body works. I can be technical if anyone wants me to be, but, in short, in order to TAKE AIR IN and then expel it into the body cavity, the trachea has to be intact, or a trach tube has to be in place.

For the body to be filling with air, there has to be an intact diaphragm and trachea, but a punctured LUNG.

You all might remember that my Venus had a punctured lung, so I know exactly what that looks like in a glider.


3) The use of the term "busted" is very technical, don't you think? It reminds me very much of a person who once wanted me to believe that his vet showed up with portable SONAR equipment.
A vet would not tell you that a glider "busted" a traqueal tube, but no worries, there is no pain associated with it, and no need to concern yourself at all.
THIS is the prattle of someone who is looking things up online and then spitting them back out hoping that the people they are speaking to are ignorant and will believe it and then pat them on the back for all the good they have done.

4) This person admits in her very first post that she has 9+ gliders that have not seen a vet. She conveniently dismissed my advice to get them ALL to the vet now that she has found one.

5) She has provided absolutely NO information - just a "diagnosis" passed along in her "dumbed down" language with poor spelling. That absolutely would not fly here on this forum, and should not be trusted by anyone in the future. She did not provide any information on the vet's advice for aftercare, medications prescribed, or prognosis. In fact, she tells us that her vet said she was not in pain. I ASSURE you that filling with air from a puncture anywhere in the respiratory system is PAINFUL. I do not believe that a vet told her it was not.

6) She says she called me, but she did not. She either called a wrong number or is lying.

I could go on, but must I? I don't think this person is telling the truth at all. I think they don't want to take the glider to the vet, so did a little research on the computer and came up with this, then concocted a story to make everyone believe she is doing right by the glider and to get a little recognition.

Maybe I'm wrong. But, ask Shawna how that usually goes.

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~*~ Val ~*~
Passionate = one step down from crazy

We can only be said to be alive in those moments when our hearts are conscious of our treasures - Thornton Wilder

We are what we are, no matter what we might wish to be, or pretend to be. - Dean Koontz in The Face

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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 4:49 pm

Val is right. I don't even have to read, because she's always right.

Okay, not really, but, a "busted traquea" after 2 days would be a dead glider. Not a blown up glider. So, total BS.

Watch for the "Liar, Liar" post to come shortly, about liars in general.

I will say, though, that there is something wrong with that glider, possibly a punctured lung. But this girl is still telling a lie, as outlined by Val, above.
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 5:04 pm

I havent read the thread....but from what I take of this...the "swelling" the idiot owner is referring to with a "busted traquea tube" would be subcutaneous emphysema...also know to us in the med field as the snap, crackle, pop..All subcutaneous emphysema is...is air that has leaked into the surrounding tissues from a "leaky airway" or punctured lung, when you push on those areas it literally feels like rice crispies sound after adding milk to the bowl, the trapped air "pops" around the tissues...hence the snap, crackle, pop reference

I call BS....with that severe of swelling as described by owner and it being due to subcutaneous emphysema there would be to much pressure surrounding those lungs and they would collapse. That glider would have been long dead by now.....

sheesh do we need a call the liar out thread???
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 5:35 pm

Chris, she did post pictures, and there is something wrong with the glider.

My point was that a lung doesn't just get punctured for no reason, there is potential for infection with a puncture, that it IS painful, and that I don't believe she saw a vet. I believe there is something wrong with the glider, I just don't believe she saw a vet.
I don't think she knows the difference between the trachea and the lungs, for one. I think she just looked for a technical term and went with it.

Venus DID have a punctured lung. She was filling with air and it was painful and it DID pop when it was pushed on. It was terrible to watch and even more terrible that she was so hurt otherwise at the same time.

I'll be adding a post about Venus' lung issue later on. It can happen to gliders (to anything with lungs). Shame on this girl for not getting appropriate treatment - not only for this glider, but for all of her gliders.

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~*~ Val ~*~
Passionate = one step down from crazy

We can only be said to be alive in those moments when our hearts are conscious of our treasures - Thornton Wilder

We are what we are, no matter what we might wish to be, or pretend to be. - Dean Koontz in The Face

My favorite color is orange - I'm the normal one.
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Chris R

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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Wed Dec 30, 2009 6:17 pm

I went and did a quick read through and that glider is HUGE...like I said..IF it was subcutaneous emphysema the glider would be dead by now...

There is obviously swelling and honestly to me it looks more like a fluid retention issue for whatever reason (severe CHF or even renal failure would cause that type of "sudden swelling" as described) although I suspect shes normally a large glider to start with.....

The whole thread is "fishy" and something isnt on the up and up...Seems more like a cry for attention to me
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:10 am

I wish I was smarter in the medical field but I'm just not. I've only been a glider owner for a little over a year and cannot pickup on the BS like you guys can. That's why I'm here I guess, to learn and maybe give a view point of someone that is considered a newbie. I was so concerned when I read that thread and could not figure out why that person wasn't immediately at the Vet's. I would have been out the door. I have my Vet information ready and an Emergency Vet ready. I really thought that the response she gave could have been true. After reading what Val and everyone else has written I have learned alot. It is good to know I can get a straight answer from you all.
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:41 am

Is it just muffled up fur, or does that female glider have a bald spot?
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:28 am

I went back and checked the time stamp on the thread as Val had stated and I see now what she was saying:

posted pictures of glider at 10:42 am and stated was looking for a Vet.

Posted at 11:02 am had found a Vet 2 hours away. Maybe could have been on the road by then.

Posted at 12:27 pm had gotten to the Vet AND had been seen and was possibly on her way back home or was at home.

Everything takes place in less than two hours for a Vet visit when the Vet was located 2 hours away. How can this be possible. I now see that it just doesn't add up just for the time stamp reason alone and this is not even taking into account the medical reasons Val posted as well.

I would love to know what Vet she took this glider to as well. Where is she located and what Vet did she see and where was the Vet located?

Unbelievable....
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:58 am

No matter what its just a sad situation where no one should ever lie about a situation like this. She cant really be lying why post then lie you saw a vet - if its bad and your that worried why not see the vet? perhaps my rose colored glasses (ha!) are comming from Brenda here but I just dont see what use it would be to make such a huge complicated lie, perhaps she can come here to explain the truth of the situation or someone can pm/call her to get exactly what the vet said or get permission to speak to the vet on the case so that we can better assist her into the proper care of the glider? I am worried the glider is really sick - and its a big deal and she just doesnt understand?
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:05 am

Of course there is something wrong with the glider Tianna. Why would anyone even try to get permission to speak to an imaginary vet? This glider has not seen a vet, I guarantee you.


Anita - your kind heart and love of gliders makes you want to believe the best of everyone and believe that every glider is getting cared for. Unfortunately, there are so many people out there that think the internet is a place where they can spin outrageous tales and others will believe them. I know that you love GG, but it really is a place full of very young owners and very uneducated people. There is very little actual GOOD advice or information on GG. I SO admire those of you that stick it out day after day. I just can't tolerate it.

It will always be the case that people will come to these forums seeking medical help, hoping that they can treat at home and avoid the expense of a vet. I am always suspicious that this is the case when I see a few things:
* someone starts a post telling us how experienced they are, how they could have been a vet, how they worked for years with animals, how they have ____(#) other gliders who are fine OR how they have had gliders for ____(#) years and never seen this. BUUUUT, there are absolutely NO exotic vets anywhere near them. Period. This initially throws up my red flags.

* Someone who repeatedly posts how they LOVE their gliders, but there are no vets around. I always call BS on that. I live in the absolute middle of nowhere and I am able to get vet care. I get in the car and go get it - because I DO love my gliders. I always want to say "get off the computer and go to the vet!"

* Someone who tells us repeatedly that it "could be _________" but still has not seen a vet. Sometimes they will tell us they have seen a vet, but usually they are just looking crap up online and self diagnosing.

* Someone who will not tell us where they are located so we can help them find a vet. Anyone actually interested in taking the glider to the vet will tell us right where they are and let us help them. If they don't, they raise my red flags.

These are a few things that raise flags. SOMETIMES these behaviors come across and the person is actually legit. SO, I ask questions. This is something you could do, too, Anita. Just ask things like
* What tests did the vet run to get this diagnosis?
* How did the vet spell that on your paperwork?
* Can you please list your vet for us so that we can put him/her in our vet database?
* What medications were you given to treat this?
* What was the prognosis?
* What aftercare instructions did the vet give you?

By asking these questions, you can appear to want to learn more and have the information to help others, but you will probably either get NO answer or get more answers that don't add up if the person is lying. Anyone telling the truth will gladly answer these questions to help others in the future.

This girl did come in this morning and give the appearance of offering more information, but again, did not answer a single question asked of her. She still has not told us the vet's name, etc. And there is still no explanation for her time stamps. And, in her first return post, she says it will take "about a week" for her to begin to "deflate" and then she comes back and miraculously the glider is 1/2 the size she was yesterday. Hallelujah!!!
She maintains that it is a perforation of the trachea. This is the point when I always just fade away. I do not have the time or the energy to explain all of this to people like this. I hope the glider lives. I hope all of her gliders get vet care. I won't stick around and participate in her fantasies.

You can also always refer medical issues to this site. We are not experts, but we are here to accumulate medical information into one spot so that we CAN be of help to others. That's what this board exists for, and you are a wonderful part of that process, Anita.

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~*~ Val ~*~
Passionate = one step down from crazy

We can only be said to be alive in those moments when our hearts are conscious of our treasures - Thornton Wilder

We are what we are, no matter what we might wish to be, or pretend to be. - Dean Koontz in The Face

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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:13 pm

Thank you Val. I will remember and continue to reference everything you just posted and learn from it daily.
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:03 pm

It was brought to my attention that the glider in this particular thread has passed away.

RIP little one. May you now experience the BEST of life, free of pain, where no ailment shall ever again reach you.

Sadly, this is what happens when we lie about going to the vet. I still do not believe this glider ever saw a vet. This girl continues to maintain that she went to the vet and to spin an elaborate tale. NONE of it adds up. BUT, to point it all out now would just be like trying to catch the wind. The damage is already done.

What she has admitted is that this glider never received any antibiotics or any pain medication. That poor glider!!! I'm not at all surprised that the glider passed.

For anyone reading this: PLEASE do not let the APPEARANCE of a glider improving fool you. Read here and in just a few stories you will see that gliders APPEAR to be improving when they simply are not. DO NOT DENY YOUR GLIDER APPROPRIATE HEALTH CARE. To do so is simply mean and selfish - no matter how you dress it up or what excuses you give. To not see a vet when a glider is in crisis is cruel. Even if you think they are getting better, they need to see a vet.

This girl was offered help - by myself and many others. She chose the route she chose. I feel so sorry for her remaining gliders who will also probably never receive any vet care.

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~*~ Val ~*~
Passionate = one step down from crazy

We can only be said to be alive in those moments when our hearts are conscious of our treasures - Thornton Wilder

We are what we are, no matter what we might wish to be, or pretend to be. - Dean Koontz in The Face

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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:11 pm

Thank You Val for offering to help this glider. I just read the thread on GG and came over here to update this one. It's so sad when people just choose NOT to do the right thing and their glider passes. Then she supposidly opted NOT to have necropsy done which means neither her nor anyone else learns from all of this. It's just to sad and I'm finding it hard to type as tears are clouding my view.

R.I.P. sweet little girl. I hope you're gliding free and peacful now.
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:27 pm

Damn, that pisses me off. Wonder how she would like for me to break her leg (or better yet, her neck) then deny her medical and any pain killers!!!!! What is it with these loonies lately???!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Glider Swelling   Sun Jan 03, 2010 11:37 pm

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